6,800 psi says Bill Nye the Science Guy on CNN – 6,800 psi coming out of the leaks at the Deepwater Horizon oil spill on the sea floor
(he said it just a little while ago on CNN Newsroom – about 10 minutes ago 7.40 or a little before that )
***
My Note -
That’s what he said has been the estimate of how much pressure is coming out of that well where we see the clouds of petroleum billowing out of the pipes. He also pointed out that “lmrp” sounds more like the engineers are getting to do what they know how to do now.
You know what, though? As humans engineering all kinds of great things – we’ve spent hundreds of years striving to get something that would produce those kinds of pressures thrusting consistently – intentionally. Its a shame we can’t use it the way we would if we had intentionally designed it to produce those forces.
Over my lifetime and many people’s lifetimes before mine, there have been hundreds of thousands – probably beyond millions of manhours spent to try and create a thrust / propulsion / turbine moving system that would provide the 6,800 psi kinds of numbers consistently that this well is doing all by itself. It is amazing – we could be celebrating except maybe for the fact that it is a mile down under the ocean and to use it / to harness it, we would have to approach it that way and we’ve been trying to stop it instead.
We could just stick a huge 747 or Airbus 380 or C-5 A engine cowling on it with its huge turbine fans and then draw the stream off on the other side of it while using its 6,800 psi movement of petroleum to turn the turbine and draw power from it. That is only one way to do it. But, it does have some interesting possibilities looking at it that way. The psi could be individually increased on each leak by restricting the flow a little and have even higher pressures offering even higher thrust to make a power generating gizmo and then harness that oil for recovery beyond that effort.
Simulation of a low bypass turbofan‘s airflow
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jet_engine
Hmmmm……….
And, it doesn’t have the high temperature problems that we have on land when creating those pressures and velocities it already has right now.
It still seems silly that they are wanting to harvest gas hydrates all over the world and that top hat design managed to be a way to do that effectively – it showed some things about doing that which could’ve been very useful if they had thought about it that way with the intention of harvesting the hydrates.
They found a way to make the gas hydrates that they said they expected, so I guess they’ve known in their deep sea drilling efforts – that can happen and never thought, “oh, gee – we ought to harvest those gas hydrates that way and intentionally do these things that accidentally got in the way a time or two.”
Containment systems with the intention of gaining something from the thrust potential could be any number of great systems we already know, including the multitude of turbine designs, whirling fan types and cylinder vortex whirling blade types or using the velocities to convert the motion of the petroleum/natural gas mixtures into some kind of productive work. It could do so many things and have that powered energy producing system harness along with a well-engineered harvest and recovery system for the product that is being released into the ocean right now.
- cricketdiane
***
I keep thinking about those huge undulating Pelarmis wave machines – there are a whole set sitting in Portugal that supposedly didn’t go on line because their funding was wrapped up in some company that was bankrupted by the economic crisis in 2007 – 2008.
But, I keep thinking every so often about retrieving the oil from the surface waters using something like that which is already made, already phenomenally huge and would utilize the natural movement of the ocean waters to move material by it, through it, under it, along the length of it.
If it had some collection system added to it, then the oil that comes by would be collected or separated from the sea water on the way by the Pelarmis “machines” which could be making energy at the same time. They could probably be bought real cheap in comparison to the original project costs created before the economic crisis changed the prices of damn near everything.
- cricketdiane
Pelamis at Agucadoura, 2008
80th Scale Model Testing, 1998
Pelamis Interactive Animation
Seatrials
http://www.pelamiswave.com/
***
I still like the idea of the huge engine cowlings of old airplanes that are sitting out in the desert boneyard right now. They are the right size. They already exist. The turbine fan blades already exist for them and are sitting there with them. They already have an “axle” for the blades that is already geared and set up to move something.
It would just be moving it backasswards from the way it was designed where the engine supplied the power to move the blades. In this case – the oil spewing from the mucked up wellhead would be the engine – and it has the added benefit of being in the same scales as the other elements of the undersea operational parts they have been using.
- cricketdiane
A Pratt & Whitney F100 turbofan engine for the F-15 Eagle and the F-16 Falcon being tested in the hush house at Robins Air Force Base, Georgia, USA. The tunnel behind the engine muffles noise and allows exhaust to escape
Airbus A380, the largest passenger jet in the world, entered commercial service in 2007. (from wikipedia entry about Airbus).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airbus
(and)
20th Scale model testing showing extreme wave
35th Scale Model testing
Nightime Seatrials
(from)
http://www.pelamiswave.com/gallery?category=videos&page=1
(and from)
http://www.pelamiswave.com/
***
The Pelamis Wave Energy Converter is a technology that uses the motion of ocean surface waves to create electricity. The machine is made up of connected sections which flex and bend as waves pass; it is this motion which is used to generate electricity.
Developed by the Scottish company Pelamis Wave Power (formerly Ocean Power Delivery), it was the world’s first commercial scale machine to generate electricity into the grid from offshore wave energy and the first to be used in a commercial wave farm project.[1] The first full scale prototype was successfully installed and generated electricity to the UK grid at the European Marine Energy Centre in Orkney, Scotland in August 2004.[2] The first wave farm consisting of three Pelamis machines and located off the coast of Portugal, was officially opened in September 2008.[3] In November 2008, after generating electricity since July 2008 [4], the project was disconnected from the grid and the machines towed back to shore.
1 of 3 Pelamis machines at the Aguçadoura Wave Park
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelamis_Wave_Energy_Converter
***
Thrust is a reaction force described quantitatively by Newton‘s second and third laws. When a system expels or accelerates mass in one direction the accelerated mass will cause a proportional but opposite force on that system.
A motorboat generates thrust (or reverse thrust) when the propellers are turned to accelerate water backwards (or forwards). The resulting thrust pushes the boat in the opposite direction to the sum of the momentum change in the water flowing through the propeller.
A rocket is propelled forward by a thrust force equal in magnitude, but opposite in direction, to the time-rate of momentum change of the exhaust gas accelerated from the combustion chamber through the rocket engine nozzle. This is the exhaust velocity with respect to the rocket, times the time-rate at which the mass is expelled, or in mathematical terms:
The forward thrust is proportional to the mass of the airstream multiplied by the velocity of the airstream.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrust
***
Thrust to power
Thrust at zero speed is zero power. Power requires work to be done, so zero velocity indicates zero work and zero power. Therefore the power of a rocket or aircraft engine is thrust times forward speed.
power (watts) = thrust (newtons) x speed (metres/second)
power (horsepower) = thrust (lbf) x speed (feet/second) / 550
power (horsepower) = thrust (lbf) x speed (feet/minute) / 33000.
For example: the Messerschmitt Me 262 with 3,960 pounds of thrust at 559 mph equates to 5,903 horsepower.
So let’s find out the propulsive power of a jet engine from its thrust. Power is the force (F) it takes to move something over some distance (d) divided by the time (t) it takes to move that distance [2]:
In case of a rocket or a jet aircraft, the force is exactly the thrust produced by the engine. If the rocket or aircraft is moving at about a constant speed, then distance divided by time is just speed, so power is thrust times speed: [3]
This formula looks very surprising, but it is correct: the propulsive power (or power available [4]) of a jet engine increases with its speed. If the speed is zero, then the propulsive power is zero. If a jet aircraft is at full throttle but is tied to a very strong chain to a tree, then the jet engine produces no propulsive power. It certainly transfers a lot of power around, but all that is wasted. Compare that to a piston engine.
The combination piston engine–propeller also has a propulsive power with exactly the same formula, and it will also be zero at zero speed –- but that is for the engine–propeller set. The engine alone will continue to produce its rated power at a constant rate, whether the aircraft is moving or not.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thrust
***
My Note -
But this oil spewing into the Gulf of Mexico at and extreme temperature difference between it and the environment around it plus the incredible 6,800 psi thrust it is making – is an engine. It is the energy of that thrust that could be harnessed as well as harvesting the petroleum and natural gas it contains.
The oil company has been burning off that methane rather than capturing it after knocking themselves out around the entire country trying to get natural gas. And, the petroleum is not only wasted going into the Gulf of Mexico waters – but the energy engine producing it against the extreme pressures one down on the sea floor of 2,000 pounds per square inch – if it is anywhere near the 6,800 psi estimated – is being wasted too while we spend nearly everyday trying to produce such a system engine for numerous applications that “create” energy / electricity / produce power / perform work of some kind in its conversion to do so.
- cricketdiane, 05-30-10
***
Now let’s see what else would work -
Gimbaled thrust is the system of thrust vectoring used in most modern rockets, including the Space Shuttle and the Saturn V lunar rockets.
In a gimbaled thrust system, the exhaust nozzle of the rocket can be swiveled from side to side. As the nozzle is moved, the direction of the thrust is changed relative to the center of gravity of the rocket.
NASA. “Gimbaled Thrust”. Beginner’s Guide to Rockets. http://exploration.grc.nasa.gov/education/rocket/gimbaled.html. Retrieved 2006-01-07. , public domain source
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gimballed_thrust
Animation of the motion of a rocket as the nozzle is gimbaled
***
See – we just need that gimbal system for the flow from off an old Saturn or Titan rocket down there sitting in the grass in Florida, or at the NASA warehouses over in Houston somewhere or Birmingham, Alabama – or wherever it is
NASA engineers successfully tested a sub-scale solid rocket motor on May 27.
› Read More
http://www.nasa.gov/centers/marshall/home/index.html
***
Cons
- Petroleum-powered vehicles are very inefficient. Only about 30% of the energy from the fuel they consume is converted into mechanical energy.[1] The rest of the fuel-source energy is inefficiently expended as waste heat. The heat and gaseous pollution emissions harm our environment.
- The inefficient atmospheric combustion (burning) of fossil fuels in vehicles, buildings, and power plants contributes to urban heat islands.[2]
- The combustion of fossil fuels leads to the release of pollution into the atmosphere. According to the Union of Concerned Scientists, a typical coal plant produces in one year:[3]
- 3,700,000 tons of carbon dioxide (CO2), could be the primary cause of global warming.
- 10,000 tons of sulfur dioxide (SO2), the leading cause of acid rain.
- 500 tons of small airborne particles, which result in chronic bronchitis, aggravated asthma, and premature death, in addition to haze-obstructed visibility.
- 10,200 tons of nitrogen oxides (NOx), (from high-temperature atmospheric combustion), leading to formation of ozone (smog) which inflames the lungs, burning lung tissue making people more susceptible to respiratory illness.
- 720 tons of carbon monoxide (CO), resulting in headaches and additional stress on people with heart disease.
- 220 tons of hydrocarbons, toxic volatile organic compounds (VOC), which form ozone.
- 170 pounds (77 kg) of mercury, where just 1⁄70 of a teaspoon deposited on a 25-acre (100,000 m2) lake can make the fish unsafe to eat.
- 225 pounds (102 kg) of arsenic, which will cause cancer in one out of 100 people who drink water containing 50 parts per billion.
- 114 pounds (52 kg) of lead, 4 pounds (1.8 kg) of cadmium, other toxic heavy metals, and trace amounts of uranium.
- Dependence on fossil fuels from volatile regions or countries creates energy security risks for dependent countries. Oil dependence in particular has led to war, major funding of radical terrorists, monopolization, and socio-political instability.
- Fossil fuels are non-renewable, un-sustainable resources, which will eventually decline in production[4] and become exhausted, with dire consequences to societies that remain highly dependent on them. (Fossil fuels are actually slowly forming continuously, but we are using them up at a rate approximately 100,000 times faster than they are formed.)
The Moss Landing Power Plant burns natural gas to produce electricity in California.
- Extracting fossil fuels is becoming more difficult as we consume the most accessible fuel deposits. Extraction of fossil fuels is becoming more expensive and more dangerous as mines get deeper and oil rigs must drill deeper, and go further out to sea.[5]
- Extraction of fossil fuels results in extensive environmental degradation, such as the strip mining and mountaintop removal of coal.[citation needed]
Gas flare from an oil refinery.
Since these power plants are thermal engines, and are typically quite large, waste heat disposal becomes an issue at high ambient temperature. Thus, at a time of peak demand, a power plant may need to be shut down or operate at a reduced power level, as sometimes do nuclear power plants, for the same reasons
(from)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_development
***
My Note -
I was trying to find a picture of those big electricity generating turbines on the Hoover Dam where it shows a cut-away diagram – The things above I stumbled on instead and thought I would go ahead and put them here because it reminds me that thinking the same old way about all these things has really trashed us – and caused continuing damages that we knew and still continued in the same way anyway.
Like I said yesterday in my posts, if we had done our normal cowboy thing in our typical and traditional American way – when the Europeans got 40 mpg on their cars, we’d have outdone them and made our cars and trucks get 80 mpg to show them up and then they would’ve had to have done better – etc.
But we didn’t, because some jackasses with thinking that didn’t pass their own noses and back pocket profits took over and stopped the process. Well, here we are with those results. Why should we need to burn 20 million barrels of oil a day or whatever it is and every drop of that we burn doing whatever we do with it – fills the air and water and soil with crap that has names as long as I am tall in pages, upon pages, upon pages of lists of it with tiny little print and a different chemical on every line?
What is the point of that if we could do something else? At 80 mpg, it at least starts to make better sense, if nothing else. And, we could do it – they made a tractor / lawn mower go 87 miles an hour and break world records the news said a couple weeks ago (on UPI) – they did that by getting more out of every drop of gasoline without doubt. We could do that. We could make our engines and propulsions using petroleum get a lot more per drop. We could even use nano-particle sprays of it in our combustion engine piston chambers and you’d be amazed at what the power differential becomes. That isn’t a finer spray. – It is something else. You ought to see the charts on what it does – and how much power comes out of it when those surface areas of the petroleum products are increased exponentially that way. Things can be done – but damn – they don’t want to . . .
- cricketdiane
***
People in America get status from filling two huge gasoline tanks on their SUV with the highest octane crap they can get in it and whipping out their credit card or cash to pay for it where everybody can see they can afford it at their local gasoline station with the highest gas prices – that would be BP.
They don’t want a nano-particle of gasoline running their vehicles, getting 80 miles to the gallon and not giving them that golden opportunity to show up everybody by buying a hundred dollars of gas every couple days to run their private whale boat and jack-rabbiting off every stoplight to make sure everybody sees them.
See, it would take the whole status out of it and mess up the entire event of filling up those tanks for twenty minutes while everybody can see them and admire having that kind of money to waste.+-
What is not so funny is this – as they burn off the methane out there in the ocean air currents of the Gulf of Mexico siphoned off from the leaking oil well:
When garbage decomposes, the methane produced is captured in pipes and later burned to produce electricity.
(and this – )
Main article: Geothermal power
Geothermal energy harnesses the heat energy present underneath the Earth. Two wells are drilled. One well injects water into the ground to provide water. The hot rocks heat the water to produce steam. The steam that shoots back up the other hole(s) is purified and is used to drive turbines, which power electric generators. When the water temperature is below the boiling point of water a binary system is used. A low boiling point liquid is used to drive a turbine and generator in a closed system similar to a refrigeration unit running in reverse.
(from)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_development
***
It’s just plain stupid. And, I won’t even look up what the burning of the methane as they are doing it – is actually putting into the airstreams that often go land falling from there.
And the controlled burnoffs of petroleum with their tall columns of black soot laden smoke that are also land-falling – even when they’ve been done 50 miles offshore. That is not a long ways in air currents. Duh.
- cricketdiane
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But since they may be the same people playing the stock market that also thought things could only go up – I better include this here -
That smoke goes up – and then all of what it contains comes down.
(my note)
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Oil spill response teams conducted a controlled burn operations in an effort to reduce the amount of oil in Gulf of Mexico yesterday. The burns lasted for more than nine hours, thanks to favorable weather conditions. Pictures of the burn operation have been posted on the official website of the oil spill response – www.deepwaterhorizonresponse.com – and can be viewed below.
The sight of burning oil billowing smoke raises some interesting questions about just how well prepared we are to manage oil spills in a manner that is safe for the environment and public health. It seems like we are being asked to sacrifice air quality in order to preserve water quality in the Gulf of Mexico.
Of course, there is a better way. For decades, we’ve been told that America is ready to make the leap into a clean energy future. Right now, the Gulf coast is paying the price for our continued reliance on fossil fuels. Lets take this opportunity to decide as a nation that oil is the fuel of our past, not of our future.
Pictures of controlled burn operations implemented by response teams fighting the oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico. U.S Coast Guard photo by Chief Petty Officer John Kepsimelis.
(from)
http://news.gather.com/viewArticle.action?articleId=281474978248298
My Note -
I don’t care who you are – that’s stupid. If it were the only option – oh, but wait it isn’t the only option and besides the fact that it puts out all that nasty for burning off what amounts to very little of the overall volume from the spill that needs to be sequestered and recovered – it is doubly, maybe triply stupid. That is massively and collectively beyond words – stupid.
And it wasn’t even necessary on top of that. If that is the best and brightest thinking – then there is something way wrong with their thinking or the idea that it is the best and brightest, because there is nothing bright about that.
- cricketdiane
***
Let me see what else we could do -
Happy Memorial Day, by the way. And, here I am still working on this for no good reason – except to honor those who came before us and gave their lives for our freedoms and rights to be a practicing citizen participant in our nation, our government, in our opportunities and in our lives. Well, that said – what else can I find that could be done -
That reminds me to add this one again right quick -
and this note about a nifty camera that I saw on an ad on the tele last night or this morning – depending on how you look at it – The ad showed the Olympus Pen camera and the commercial was supposedly shot using it – that was so nifty – I’d love to get one of those sometime, it looks like it is a good tool for a cross-platform kind of camera with changeable lenses like the SLRs use but digital and video capable too. Looks pretty nifty.
And this which I posted yesterday – and is definitely not nifty -
TONY HAYWARD, CEO, BP: I think the first thing to recognize is that this is an unprecedented accident. The industry has been working in the deep water for 25 years and not had to contend with this.
As our initial assessment of the accident has indicated, which we’ve now shared with both Congress and Secretary Salazar, there are a whole series of failures here. Most importantly, the fail-safe mechanism, the blowout preventer, failed on three separate occasions.
Now, having said all of that, it’s clear that this will be a transforming event in the history of deep-water exploration. It’s very clear that much more needs to be put in place to deal with this situation should it ever occur again.
Clearly our intentions going forward will be to change many things to ensure that it never can occur.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Now, John, here’s what’s interesting. He mentions — he even said there were a series of failures. So my question is — and I know you asked him this — if there were a series of failures, why didn’t somebody do something the first time that blowout preventer failed?
ROBERTS: Yes. That would be a good — a good question to ask and one that you would think would get a good answer. Now let’s just take it back a little bit. In the House Energy Committee yesterday, a memo was circulated which suggested that the people who were on board that rig, who are operating that well, knew that there were some problems.
For example, about five hours before the explosion, there was a loss of drilling fluid, which suggested that maybe there was a problem with the blowout preventer. And 51 minutes before the explosion, some of that drilling fluid was coming back up through the well and then there was — what was called a significant anomaly in the pressure.
But still they went ahead with production. They didn’t shut down that well. And you know — and I said to Tony Hayward, I said a series of problems would suggest that somewhere along the line somebody could say, hey, we’ve got a serious problem here, before it trips any further down that line, throw the switch, cut it off.
Why didn’t anyone do that?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
HAYWARD: As in all major accidents of this sort, what we’re seeing here is a whole series of failures. We’ve identified in our initial assessment at least seven. And that investigation is far from complete because the blowout preventer is still on the seabed.
We’ve not only been able to interview BP people, not anyone from any other companies, and of course the rig is also still on the seabed. So I’m certain that the regulatory investigations — in particular, the Marine Board — will determine exactly what happened and the sequence of events.
ROBERTS: Is it safe to say, Mr. Hayward, that the oil industry has pushed the boundaries of drilling but you haven’t made similar advancements in disaster preparedness?
HAYWARD: I think what this has demonstrated is that was very significant progress has been made in terms of surface response. There is clearly the need to have much more preparedness with expect to subsea response. That is undoubtedly one of the big lessons.
(END OF VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIPS: Talking about undoubtedly one of big lessons. Well, there’s also another question out there. How much did cost play in all of this? Cost versus the safety of these workers.
ROBERTS: You know, I asked him that. I asked him if they cut corners to try to keep costs down and then — and keep the rig in production. He told me that it has nothing to do with cost, that this is the first time in 25 years of drilling in the Gulf of Mexico that anything this significant has ever happened.
Other people, though, of course will disagree with that, saying why wasn’t there a half million-dollar acoustic actuator built into that blowout preventer, which could have shut it all down?
A lot of questions will be asked in the days and weeks ahead, Kyra, as to whether or not they were skimping on safety here, trying to save costs and trying to keep their production value as high as possible.
But as Hayward said in his first response here that you heard, he believes that this will be a transforming event that the industry really is going to have to come to the table here with much more comprehensive disaster preparedness plans.
And I’m certain that there will probably be something in the area of more government oversight once they reform this minerals management service, which according to the inspector general has kind of been just running free in its relationships with the government.
And there will be far more eyes looking over their shoulders as they sink these wells even deeper into the Gulf of Mexico.
PHILLIPS: And on the notes of cost and safety, CNN, we were able to obtain documents that came across yesterday, John, with regard to safety measures that were disregarded for the sake of cost. We’ll talk more about that coming up at 9:30. John Roberts, thanks so much.
http://archives.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1005/26/cnr.01.html
(from)
CNN NEWSROOM
BP CEO Says Spill Caused by Series of Failures; Top Kill Challenges; FDA Investigating Tylenol Recalls; Old Memo Suggests BP Cheaped Out on Safety; Troops-to-Border Plan Gets Pushback; Oil Could Spoil Gulf for Years
Aired May 26, 2010 – 09:00 ET
(and this – )
Cooper: Little being done in Lousiana 3:18
A look underneath the oil spill 2:20
BP memo puts price tag on lives 5:10
(from CNN Videos this week more or less)
***
The Gulf’s oily peril 2:33
(and from this story – )
Robert Dudley, the BP official who appeared on CNN’s “State of the Union” and other talk shows, said early estimates that 5,000 barrels (210,000 gallons) were leaking into the ocean each day came from government satellite imaging, rather than BP’s figures.
An updated estimate issued last week by a government-led team put the leak at 12,000-19,000 barrels (504,000 to 798,000 gallons) a day, more than double the initial figure.
“The best way to measure those early rates or estimate those early rates were from satellite data, not BP data,” Dudley said on the CBS program “Face the Nation.”
Not true, countered Carol Browner, the assistant on energy and climate change to President Obama, who spoke to the NBC program “Meet the Press” and the CBS show.
“The very, very first estimates came from BP,” Browner said on the CBS program. “They had the footage of the plume. The government then did satellite imagery and we realized that those estimates were not accurate.”
Browner noted that BP had a “vested financial interest” in downplaying the size of the leak.
“They will ultimately pay a fine based on those rates,” Browner said. “That’s why we brought in an independent team. We did not include BP in the estimates that were made available this week.”
Rep. Ed Markey of Massachusetts, who heads the House Energy and Environment subcommittee, agreed that the company “had a stake in low-balling the number right from the very beginning.”
“I think that they were either lying or they were incompetent,” Markey said on the CBS program. Noting that BP has consistently provided information that proved to be wrong, Markey said he had “no confidence whatsoever in BP.”
“I think they do not know what they are doing,” Markey said, adding: “I don’t think that people should really believe what BP is saying in terms of the likelihood of anything that they’re doing is going to turn out as they’re predicting.”
Browner emphasized steps the government has taken to oversee BP’s efforts to stop the leak, noting the administration ordered the company to begin digging two relief wells intended to eventually stop the leak instead of a single one proposed by BP.
In addition, she said, it was government scientists led by Energy Secretary Steven Chu who recommended that BP halt the so-called “top kill” effort to pump heavy mud down the well to try to plug the leak.
“It was that group of people yesterday who looked at the information we had gotten from ‘top kill’ and realized that it was too dangerous to continue to proceed to put pressure down into that well, that things could happen that would make the situation worse,” Browner said.
http://us.cnn.com/2010/US/05/30/oil.spill.bp.government/index.html?hpt=T1
***
My Note -
So, what kinds of materials are available that could take the oil out of the water – Hmmm………..
There have been any number of them on the videos on CNN and YouTube and elsewhere that include all kinds of things that work – but none of them are being used by BP and their contractors through the Marine Spill Response Corporation. Do they need a phone book or something? Are any of them watching the news? Do they have internet service available to the decision-makers or access to these things or are they isolated from them for some reason?
Hmmmmmmm. again.
If they used the idea of harnessing the power from the high pressure thrust coming out of the oil leaking into the Gulf of Mexico – it ought to yield some practical options that haven’t been considered. But, then they didn’t think to simply corral the damn oil that came out in the first place with large sturdy booms – so what the hell. The thinking is studied in a set of pathways and then stuck in them as well. They aren’t going to consider bringing a tanker out to suck the oil off the surface – as they did in the 1993 spill, offshore Saudi Arabia or somewhere in the Middle East.
And they’ve had that suggestion from the very outset.
And they didn’t corral the oil with booms and then skim it from the surface or siphon it off the surface which they could’ve done.
And they didn’t use substantial booms to protect the coast.
And they didn’t cap the well using the brilliant ideas of any number of people in the first place or in the first few days thereafter.
And they still have the same three plans they did have in the first place for stopping the well which they continue to use in some variation.
One – stick an upside down funnel on it.
Two – stick some mud and junk in there to stop it up and then pour in cement.
Three – stick a straw in there and get some of it up to a ship.
Hmmmmmm………………
Where are the rest of the things that could be done?
Where are the options that I’ve thought up and other people have thought up and other independent engineers and scientists have thought up and kids have thought up and governors, senators, congressmen and reporters have thought up and academics, educators and science people have thought up?
And, where are those ideas being used that don’t fit their original plan whether it is how to sop up the oil or to mitigate its damages or to stop the leaks or to use the high pressures and velocities to do some productive work along with harnessing and recovering the oil and methane / gas hydrates / natural gas, etc.?
Where are these brilliant minds that can’t seem to think any other ways about it while everyone everywhere else of any level of education can and have generated thousands of ideas and methods – thousands of which will work?
What is wrong with this picture?
In fact, what is right about this picture?
It looks like just about nothing is right about it, in fact.
Do you know that no matter how much money can be thrown at a thing – that if it isn’t done effectively knowing how to apply that money effectively to solutions that will work – that it won’t fix it?
And, in fact – we have all seen how that has made things more catastrophic and more expansive in this case of the oil spill in the Deepwater Horizon event from the beginning that started before the explosion and sinking and initial discovery of the leaks exploding oil into the water – until now with the multitude of mistakes made while using everybody’s coattail to excuse the fact they did it that way. BP is a real piece of work. And, so it is with the entire oil industry as a matter of fact. They are all a real piece of work.
They are all like an accident waiting to happen. No – wait correct that. They are accidents waiting to happen – every single one of them. And, it never takes more than one – for it to be a catastrophe of nightmarish proportions.
And their estimates and views of the value of human lives is as sick as Hitler’s and his SS leadership -
“Built upon the Nazi ideology, the SS, under Heinrich Himmler‘s command, was responsible for many of the crimes against humanity perpetrated by the Nazis during World War II, and most of the particularly egregious ones.”
- cricketdiane
***
Now, I say that because of this – doesn’t it seem that everytime anyone or any group of people get that mentality about being the “master race” and some way better than everybody else and get any degree of power – that they do horrendous things with that power, in pursuit of sustaining that power and as a result of that power?
Including BP and other oil producers in this – maybe they’ve had way too much power for way too long and maybe we’ve been kidding ourselves into believing they would be honorable with that power. And, maybe kissing their knees at every turn has given them the idea that they are a much better “master race” than the rest of us. It sure seems to have done that to Wall Street players – maybe it did that to the oil industry players too.
And they don’t mind considering people as a cost analysis estimation of lives lost being less expensive than lives saved and honored and respected and protected as valuable.
Hmmmm…………
It also just seems to muck it up -whether it is a business or a corporation or an industry or a political ideology or a political party or a national leader or an economic giant of some kind.
Now, what do we do?
- cricketdiane
I still think the damn bunch of them should be either forced to take a real bath in the stuff – crude oil and crude oil globs mixed with dispersants in the bathrooms of their houses – or be thrown into the waters of the Gulf of Mexico near a boat, drawn out for lunch covered with the shit and thrown back in a few times so they can get a realistic feel for the problems they’ve created.
It would only be right.
And, they might come out human beings with better judgment than the monsters that they were when we threw them in there with what they created.
****
How can that many people be that damn wrong that much of the time – consistently?
How is that even possible?
***
They could freeze it with liquid nitrogen – useful at those depths – then cap it or harness it or whatever it.
They could close it off using an engine cowling and turbine system used on electricity generation plants and airplane engines / rocket thruster systems. And retrieve electricity from it plus harness and recover the oil and methane.
They could harvest the methane gas hydrates using the process they accidentally discovered with the last upside down funnel “top hat” system they tried.
They could place large hard booms around the full spill still cohesive enough to be kept out of the looping current and corral the rest of it the same way before it hits the coastal areas.
They could use the architectural fabrics like they use on stadiums and airports to anchor down a huge tent structure over the entire leaking gas columns and harvest the oil and the methane from that point anywhere at any level they want above the mile below the surface spot where it is so extreme.
They could tap every leak for the sort of work engine it is providing and not try to stop them up at all. By harnessing each leak site for its potential as an energy engine using the 6,800 pounds per square inch pressure and / or the temperature difference between the sea environment and the temperature of the petroleum jets and similar qualities of fact in existence right this minute.
They could get a tanker from Japan or Saudi Arabia or Kuwait to come pull the oil off the surface and from the subsea plumes where it is known to have been sitting before it goes anywhere else.
They could use the ocean’s natural power in the effort to accumulate and harvest the oil – using the Pelarmis system and an addition of a siphoning or permeable screen and capture system with it.
They could build a capture column in concrete sections the way they build bridge pilings with sinking large sections – connecting them until the 8 – 20 foot diameter concrete collar provides some measure of contained distribution point nearer to the surface where pressures and temperatures are not so severe and extreme.
They could consider this in the same way as a jet propulsion engine instead of something to plug up or kill. Then in using that mentality about solutions – harness the work or the high pressure velocities for some desirable permanent solutions which both provide work conversion or electricity generating and captures the oil as well for harvest. I as much as said that already – however, using that mentality and approach generally would go farther to awaken the minds of engineers and science geeks for the solutions that could be generated that will work than any one other thing.
They could consider a chemical equation in all this – rather than a mechanical one – they are going to use fractional distillation once their shit gets onshore anyway – why not incorporate that process where its coming out of the sea floor – the pressures are already there. The column of oil is already available coming into it at high pressures, inside a cooling system that can’t be any better with all our refrigeration equipment going full blast. Why not?
AND -
I don’t know if anybody has noticed this – but the leak on top of the blowout preventer they are talking about sticking an upside down funnel on this time – isn’t the only place that has been leaking at 19,000 barrels or 70,000 barrels a day or whatever it actually is.
That means something – really serious – categorically – really, really serious.
- cricketdiane, 05-30-10
***
We haven’t even been looking at the original leaking spot shown in the first video clip they released. They’ve had us all looking at the one they were fiddling with on the stick mud and golfball chunks into the blowout preventer internal column and see if it will get stuck enough to stick some concrete in there.
(my note)
***
There have been people in the CNN blog about solutions people offered and other places on the web that suggested using military assets to blow up the well but apparently they didn’t like that idea either. I’m not sure if that would have worked or not – but it sure would’ve made everybody feel better had it been done near the start of this mess and prevented most of the rest of what we’ve experienced now from it.
The fact is – there are solutions and they aren’t using them. There are any number of things about the ocean chemistry and its power generally – that can be used to clean up the mess, too. And, they aren’t doing that either.
There are designs based on peat moss, human hair obviously, and biotics that break the oil down but many have fixed nitrogen fertilizers included in them to do the job and that can make another nightmare on top of the one that was there in the first place when applied to marshlands – does make it look like a golf course though where the oil isn’t as evident to people that would be bothered by seeing it.
There are booms which are more substantial and the product used by the Louisiana National Guard which still impresses me to this day with the collapsible / expandable fabric and frame boxes filled with a non-toxic absorbent polymer or copolymer that allowed the water to be cleaned of the oil on its way by while protecting the coastal estuaries and beaches and animals. Amazing – but the BP crowd isn’t buying those nor including them on the list of options either. They aren’t buying the substantial booms used by the Navy either nor the NOAQ types of systems that can prevent the oil from going into passages of the marsh lands and other inland waterways and keep it from beaches, although I was happy to see the National Guard over the last few days using that system to protect 7 miles of beach on one of the islands.
Why doesn’t the Marine Spill Response Corporation or BP have any of these things available nor any of these products including the one being backed by Kevin Costner, I think it is. Why aren’t these things operational at forty-one days later knowing the flimsy booms are a piece of shit which was never tested in real world conditions and hurricanes, tropical storms, afternoon storms, high winds, high surf, storm surges and pickup by the currents is all going to happen?
After the destruction of over 30 acres of pristine animals, fishes, birds, insects and marine animals in marshes along the Louisiana shores – what did they think they were doing to make it well-known that they didn’t give a damn over at BP?
Their attitude was that “it’s only thirty acres.” Look at any of the places in the news clips where the BP executives say it – and they have an attitude in their body language that says it all – like big deal – a few acres of swamp got a little oil in it. And those places are complete zones of death nearly in total even today already – and expanding outwards from there in every direction and at every level of the food chain it affects.
Nope, they just aren’t going to “get it” about why that is important and how much death and sickness and destruction and unnecessary suffering to those animals that it represents factually. The BP group needs to be forced to go out there and stick their hands in it without a glove to protect them. I swear they do. And then tempting as it is to leave them there . . .
- cricketdiane
***
Do you know that in the history of the world – BP already has placed itself in this moment into those history books as the most vile destructive force on an ecosystem and destroyer of the US economic recovery that had been underway before their reactions to this event started the process of undermining it and altering its course.
They do have a place in history now for certain. The people who have supported their viewpoint and the viewpoint of maintaining protections for the entire oil industry along with supporting their profit harvests from our national waters, our national lands and our national wealth of mineral and petroleum resources will be written alongside them for the history books.
That is a fact. And, our children and grandchildren and people around the world will know them for what they’ve been doing that devalued human life in pursuit of their corporate goals and destroyed rather than created and killed rather than protecting or enhancing life for all the creatures including people that it touched. Those that support them and the ways they’ve been doing things will be known right beside them over the course of time for what they’ve done and what they allowed to be done. That is their legacy – this is what we have in the Gulf of Mexico – their legacy to us from all their efforts and devaluation of life in pursuit of their own benefits at the expense of us all.
Hmmmm………….
There were protesters that hung a flag on the UK headquarters of BP and those that poured artificial petroleum crude oil over themselves in protests across the US and Houston at the BP headquarters there. It doesn’t matter.
There are boycotts and planned protests – signs being painted up even as I sit writing this and there are probably over a million people involved in some respect across a broad spectrum that are involved with these things across the US and across the world. And, it doesn’t matter – BP still runs things with impunity and contempt as if their ways are the only right ones and they are sure they are untouchable and incapable of being touched by this event over any course of time. Shareholders still back them, the stock market pension fund portfolios still carry their shares despite the financial risks attached to them and their belief is that their liability is limited, although it isn’t in reality.
So, what to do?
What do I know that would make gasoline and diesel fuel just about obsolete entirely and extraordinarily fast in application? Hmmmmmm……….
Is there anyway that Americans would adopt anything except pumping more gasoline fuels into something they own? HMMM>
………
………
thinking ……….
thinking some more …………
thinking about the Tesla car and the new Sunbeam car ……………
hmmmm…………..
wait – those are too expensive for 90% of the people in America to own the way they’ve been doing things in the last twenty years or better.
Hmmmmm……..
cars can be retrofit for vegie oil -
but who wants to smell like a french fry going down the road ………..
and who wants a car covered in flexible solar film panels that doesn’t use gas at all and looks like a UFO going down the road >>>>>>>>
HMMMMM>
What about issuing a change in where golf carts and Cushman trucks can be used – increasing the mpg on all existing cars – and allowing sidewalks to be used for Segways and mini-Coopers, Cushmans, ATV four-wheeler electrics and golf carts – HMMMM ……….
What about using more geothermal plants for electricity generating in the US instead of driving crap into the ground to get the shale oil and last vapors out of the old petroleum wells with forced injections of foreign chemicals into them?
What about bringing every person in America into an agreement on something one time – one single time for one single purpose and then working outwards from there to see what else we could do as a nation?
Maybe like joining in the singular purpose of sending $5.00 from each us individually in the mail to somebody or somebody’s business in the Gulf of Mexico and Louisiana in particular that have been destroyed by this, including the families of the men killed in the rig explosion. I could pick an address of somebody there and send them $5.00 in an envelope – I’m sure everybody else could do that too. We could all just pick one from the phone book or online and send them $5.00 to add to what they have to get their families and businesses through this. Could we all join together and do that?
We wouldn’t even have to agree on where to send it or to whom or anything else except why to be doing it and I can see that as an agreement that we give a damn. These are our neighbors and countrymen. Many people in Nashville need the same thing too. And, we’ve done it before. Why not now?
Hmmmmm……………
Then maybe we could fix this other stuff together woolly though it might be.
I’m going to think some about that and go make a bit of something to eat.
Be back in awhile with another idea or two. I’m working on it.
- cricketdiane
Happy Memorial Day, America
***
Rep. Edward Markey challenged the assertion by oil giant BP’s chief executive that no underwater oil plumes have formed because of the Gulf of Mexico spill. FULL STORY
(from CNN – US)
***
on May 31,
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